xREL.v3

US HDTV - CRF - Thema

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DasFragezeichen
DasFragezeichen plǝɟʇɥɔılɟd
20. Jun 2011, 12:41 Uhr
Moin,
Wie einige vielleicht bemerkt haben, setzt sich in der US TV-Szene momentan der Wandel durch, dass man auf CRF setzt.
So haben DIMENSION, ORENJI, DAH, FTP (UK), BiA (UK) und IMMERSE (und noch andere) in den letzten Tagen Serien pred, die mit crf encoded wurden.
Ich bin nicht so der Encoding Experte, gehe aber davon aus, dass es mehr qualitätsfordernd ist (und bei 720p Blu-ray sogar Größe reduzieren soll).
Würde mal gerne von den Encoder-Experten hier wissen, was sie davon halt. :)
Mfg,
DasFragezeichen

smizz
smizz User
20. Jun 2011, 13:12 Uhr
CRF bedeutet, dass sich die Dateigröße nach der gewünschten Ähnlichkeit zum Original und der übrigbleibenden Entropie, abhängig vom verwendeten Resizer, Filtern und Encodingsettings richtet.

Wenn CRF mit Know-How eingesetzt wird, dann spricht absolut nichts dagegen.

Gegenbeispiele sind Menschen, die von den x264-Settings und ihren Auswirkungen auf die Komprimierbarkeit und die Bildqualität keine Ahnung haben.
Die gesamte o.g. Kette, Quellentropie, Filter (Resizing), Encodersettings und neuerdings auch die FPS entscheiden, ob das CRF-Release beim gleichen CRF-Wert nun 1,5GB oder 5GB groß wird.

Daher steht vor der endgültigen Einführung von CRF noch eine dringende Verabredung der Groups über die Verarbeitungskette, andernfalls wird es zu Schwierigkeiten kommen. Wer will entscheiden, ob jetzt ein CRF mit Settings A "korrekter" ist als ein CRF mit Settings B, und wann ist ein proper gerechtfertig.

 
Celerion User
27. Jun 2011, 15:03 Uhr
Es wurde mit der Unterstützung der x264 und matroska entwickler ein neues "Ruleset" geschrieben. Ist aber nuked. (Was das heuzutage auch immer noch bedeutet...) Viele Groups releasen jetzt zwar CRF, jedoch nicht immer nach dem Ruleset... (z.B. IMMERSE und DIMENSION). Andere Groups machen weiter wie bisher (z.B. CTU).

The 720p x264 TV Releasing Standards 2011
[Spoiler: Zum Lesen hier klicken!]
┌─────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┐
│                                                                             │
│                  The 720p x264 TV Releasing Standards 2011                  │
└─────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘
┌─────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┐
│     Requirements: Notepad with terminal font or any other ascii viewer.     │
├──────────────────────────────┬───────────────┬──────────────────────────────┤
│                              └───[ INTRO ]───┘                              │
│                                                                             │
│ This  standard  aims  to produce consistent quality releases. If consistent │
│ release size doesn't  matter, but consistent quality does, this is for you. │
│                                                                             │
└───────┬┬───────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┬┬───────┘
┌───────┴┴─────────────────┬───────────────────────┬─────────────────┴┴───────┐
│                          └───[ RELEASE RULES ]───┘                          │
│                                                                             │
│  This document takes effect starting with shows airing from 2011-06-15.     │
│                                                                             │
│                                                                             │
│  Video:                                                                     │
│   - 1080i/p sources are to be cropped and resized using sharp resizers such │
│     as  Lanczos/Lanczos4,  Spline36,   or   Blackman.  Bicubic  is  banned. │
│   - Video  taken  from  the  decoded  HD  output  of  a  set-top box  (e.g. │
│     component,  DVI,  HDMI)  may be used as a source; source must be tagged │
│     in  dirname as AHDTV. Releases taken from a natively recorded transport │
│     stream  shall  be  tagged as HDTV and do not dupe AHDTV releases. AHDTV │
│     releases do dupe HDTV. AHDTV captures must be done at the native format │
│     of the channel, i.e. 720p or 1080i.                                     │
│   - Improper  methods  of  IVTC  that  result  in  loss  of half the fields │
│     (SeparateFields.SelectEven,  YV12InterlacedSelectTopFields)  are banned │
│   - Improper  IVTC  methods  that  result  in jerky playback, such as Force │
│     Film, are banned                                                        │
│   - 1080i video sources must be deinterlaced with a smart deinterlacer such │
│     as Yadif. FieldDeinterlace is banned.                                   │
│   - Group  watermarks  of  any  kind  on  the  video  will not be tolerated │
│   - Intros,  outros,  betweenos,  or  any  other  form of defacement of the │
│     episode will not be tolerated                                           │
│   - Sources  that  sideconvert  1080i  to 720p (such as Bell Expressvu) are │
│     banned                                                                  │
│   - Upconverted  sources must not be done as 720p.x264. See notes regarding │
│     HR.PDTV.x264.                                                           │
│                                                                             │
│  Audio:                                                                     │
│   - Must be original source audio, AC3 if available                         │
│   - Re-encoding/transcoding audio or faking header is forbidden             │
│   - Dupes  based  on audio format are forbidden and must be tagged INTERNAL │
│   - Multi-language audio tracks are not allowed.                            │
│   - Severe  audio  drops  resulting in the inability to understand material │
│     dialogue  is  considered  to  be technically flawed and may be propered │
│   - Audio  that  is  120ms  or  more  out of sync or drifts more than 120ms │
│     between any two points (e.g. needing -80 at one and +40 at another)  is │
│     considered   to   be   technically   flawed   and   may   be   propered │
│                                                                             │
│  Framerate:                                                                 │
│   - IVTC or deinterlacing must be applied as needed                         │
│   - 50/60fps  video  such as live events may be kept at original fps, if it │
│     was produced at such high rate (i.e has unique frames)                  │
│   - In rare cases, 25/50Hz sources should be IVTC'd to 24fps.               │
│   - In rare cases, 30/60Hz sources should be IVTC'd to 25fps.               │
│     Failure to IVTC is a technical flaw.                                    │
│                                                                             │
│  Codec/Container:                                                           │
│   - Must be x264                                                            │
│   - Must use Matroska (.mkv) for container                                  │
│   - x264 version used must be no older than 30 days from the newest revision│
│     available on x264.nl                                                    │
│   - Stripping or falsifying encode information in the file header is banned │
│   - Custom  muxing  tools are permitted; however, output must be compatible │
│     with  standard  demuxers  to  the  same  extent that files created with │
│     MKVToolnix  are. Custom muxers may not excessively pad files; excessive │
│     padding  is  defined as more than is used by mkvmerge 4.0.0 with header │
│     compression disabled.                                                   │
│   - Custom Matrices are allowed                                             │
│   - Deblocking  must  be  used;  values are at the discretion of the group. │
│     (default is enabled, 0:0 settings)                                      │
│   - Minimum medium (default) or higher (--preset) must be used              │
│   - Encode must not be segmented                                            │
│   - Keyframe  interval  (--keyint) must be at least 200 and at most 300. It │
│     is  recommended  to  be  10*framerate  (film=240,  PAL=250,  NTSC=300). │
│   - Constant  Rate  Factor  (--crf)  must be 20 for low motion shows (e.g.  │
│     documentary, reality, scripted, variety, talk shows).                   │
│   - Constant Rate Factor (--crf)  must  be  21-23  for  high  motion  shows │
│     (e.g. sports). values are at the discretion of the group                │
│   - Allowed parameters for (--tune) are film/grain/animation                │
│   - Level 4.1 must be respected.                                            │
│   - Suggested command line should be:                                       │
│     x264.exe --crf 20 --level 4.1 -o out.mkv in.avs                         │
│                                                                             │
│  Resolution:                                                                │
│   - Crop  to  closest  mod2  without  undercropping. Then, if width>1280 or │
│     height>720,  downscale  with 1:1 SAR to fit in 1280x720. Never upscale, │
│     never add borders.                                                      │
│   - Encoded Video resolution must be within 2% of the original aspect ratio │
│     To calculate AR error (%): (Original AR - Release AR)/Original AR * 100 │
│     OAR = (SourceWidth-CropLeft-CropRight)/(SourceHeight-CropTop-CropBottom)│
│     Release AR  = EncodedWidth / EncodedHeight                              │
│                                                                             │
│  Subs:                                                                      │
│   - Optional, but encouraged                                                │
│   - text based format is preferred (e.g. SubRip, SubStation Alpha, etc).    │
│   - Subtitles must be muxed into the MKV. "Subs" directories are forbidden. │
│   - Burned  subtitles  will  only  be  allowed  when  the  source  exhibits │
│     such subtitles in the picture itself                                    │
│   - Multi-language  subtitles  cannot  be  used  as  a  basis  for  a  dupe │
│   - Group watermarks in subtitles are strictly forbidden.                   │
│                                                                             │
│  Packaging:                                                                 │
│   - Releases must be packed in RAR file format.                             │
│   - Rars must be in multiples of 50 MB, no more than 99 files               │
│     1MB = 1,000,000 bytes                                                   │
│   - Multi-episode  releases  with no clear delineation such as credits must │
│     not be split                                                            │
│   - RAR Compression must not be used                                        │
│   - Recovery and MD5 record are optional                                    │
│   - Encryption or password protection is forbidden                          │
│   - Must have SFV and NFO                                                   │
│   - RAR, SFV, and sample files must have unique filenames                   │
│                                                                             │
│  Credits/Previously On:                                                     │
│   - It  is  suggested  that  any  previously  on footage be included in the │
│     release, but it is not required.                                        │
│   - Full  end  credits  must  be  included  if they contain show content or │
│     outtakes/bloopers.  End  credits  are  optional  if  they  are clean or │
│     contain    promotions    for    future   episodes   or   other   shows. │
│                                                                             │
│  Samples:                                                                   │
│   - REQUIRED!                                                               │
│   - 50-70 seconds in length and  in  a  separate  folder  marked  as Sample │
│   - Must   be  taken  from  the  episode, i.e.-   not   encoded  separately │
│   - Stream  samples  are  recommended  for  any questionable issue with the │
│     source, e.g. no IVTC possible, IVTC to 24.975fps, etc.                  │
│                                                                             │
│                                                                             │
│  Propers:                                                                   │
│   - Propers  are  only  permitted  in  the  case of a technical flaw in the │
│     original release (e.g. Bad IVTC, Interlacing, missing footage, resizing │
│     720p source, bad crop, commercials, bad x264 settings used, bad source, │
│     etc.)                                                                   │
│   - Scrolling messages added by a station (e.g. weather, Amber alerts) must │
│     be   at   least   30   seconds   in  length  in  order  to  nuke/proper │
│   - Over-  or under-cropping by more than 1 pixel is considered a technical │
│     flaw,   although   it   is   preferable   to  crop  the  1  pixel  out. │
│   - Proper  reason  must  be clearly stated in nfo, including timecodes and │
│     extent of the flaw when appropriate                                     │
│   - Sample of propered release is encouraged                                │
│   - Qualitative propers are not allowed                                     │
│   - Flaws  (such  as  drops) present in any optional content are not a flaw │
│     and shall not be nuked or propered.                                     │
│   - Propers  based  upon  the  rules  set  forth  here  are allowed only on │
│     releases that come after this document is made public                   │
│                                                                             │
│  Internals:                                                                 │
│   - All internals must  conform  to TVx2642k11 rules, with the exception of │
│     minor   known   technical   issues   and  different (--crf)  parameter. │
│     Using  the  INTERNAL  tag  to try and protect a severely flawed release │
│     from nukes is forbidden.                                                │
│   - Using  INTERNAL.DIRFIX  as  a  cheap  attempt  at  avoiding  a  nuke is │
│     forbidden.  If  the  release  is technically flawed, it is still deemed │
│     nukable  both  before  and  after  an attempted INTERNAL.DIRFIX and the │
│     DIRFIX shall be nuked for fix.for.nuke.                                 │
│                                                                             │
│  Directory Naming:                                                          │
│   - Show.Name.SXXEXX.Episode.title.720p.HDTV.x264-GROUP                     │
│     Episode title is optional                                               │
│     Episode title  is  required  on  some  shows   that  dont  have  SxxExx │
│   - Show.Name.PartXX.720p.HDTV.x264-GROUP for miniseries                    │
│   - Show.Name.YYYY-MM-DD.720p.HDTV.x264-GROUP for daily shows               │
│     Sport:                                                                  │
│     - League.YYYY.MM.DD.Event.EXTRA.TAGS.720p.HDTV.x264-GROUP               │
│     - Competition.YYYY-MM.Event.EXTRA.TAGS.720p.HDTV.x264-GROUP             │
│     Using  just  the  year  is only permitted if the event is once per year │
│     (e.g. a WWE PPV).  In  the case of leagues which have seasons that span │
│     multiple years, it is permissible to tag the release with just the years│
│     of the season.  Inclusion  of MM and DD is mandatory for all constantly │
│     running shows (e.g. WWE).                                               │
│     The   following   are   some   examples  of  correct  directory  names: │
│     - EPL.2010.01.01.Manchester.United.vs.Arsenal.720p.HDTV.x264-GROUP      │
│     - TNA.Impact.2010.03.02.720p.HDTV.x264-GROUP                            │
│     - WWE.WrestleMania.2010.PPV.720p.HDTV.x264-GROUP                        │
│   - ALL others are FORBIDDEN. (e.g 0x00 000 EXX.EP.TITLE)                   │
│   - Different  shows  that have the same title in different countries (e.g. │
│     Law & order) must  have  the  ISO 3166-1 alpha 2  country code  in  the │
│     directory name,  except  for  UK  shows   (e.g.  Law.and.Order.UK   not │
│     Law.and.Order.GB).  ISO  country  code  need  not  apply  to the show's │
│     country  of  origin (e.g. Law.and.Order.US is forbidden).               │
│   - Different  shows  with  the  same  name and produced in different years │
│     must  have  the  year  of  the  first  season  in  the  directory name, │
│     e.g.  Human.Target.2010  and  Doctor.Who.2005.   However,  the  initial │
│     series does not need a year tag.                                        │
│   - The use of audio format tags such as AAC, AC3, and AC3.x.x is FORBIDDEN │
│   - READ.NFO    is    allowed;    however,    discretion   is   recommended │
│   - PROPER.READ.NFO  is  NOT allowed. The NFO is REQUIRED to have a reason; │
│     therefore, the tag is redundant.                                        │
│   - Other  permitted  tags are: PROPER, REPACK, RERIP, REAL, UNCUT, DUBBED, │
│     SUBBED, INTERNAL, OAR, PPV                                              │
│   - Acceptable  characters  in  naming  a  directory  include (NO spaces or │
│     double dots - single dots ONLY):                                        │
│                                                                             │
│       ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ                                            │
│       abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz                                            │
│       0123456789._-                                                         │
│                                                                             │
│  Nukes:                                                                     │
│   Releases must be nuked for any of the following reasons:                  │
│   - Any valid proper listed in the propers section                          │
│   - Missing nfo, or missing Sample                                          │
│   - Invalid directory naming format                                         │
│   - Mislabeled  directory  that  could  prevent  finding  the  release in a │
│     dupecheck,  including  incorrect season/episode/date or incorrect title │
│   - Dupe                                                                    │
│                                                                             │
│                                                                             │
│   Fixes:                                                                    │
│   - The  following  fixes  are  allowed: NFOFix, SampleFix, DirFix, SyncFix │
│   - RAR  and  SFV  fixes  are  not  allowed.  REPACK  your  entire release. │
│   - The  original  release  shall  be  unnuked when a valid fix is released │
│   - A  proper  may  not be released for an issue that was fixed, unless the │
│     fix does not completely correct the issue                               │
│                                                                             │
└───────┬┬───────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┬┬───────┘
┌───────┴┴───────────────┬────────────────────────────┬──────────────┴┴───────┐
│                        └───[ NOTES TO THE RULES ]───┘                       │
│                                                                             │
│  HR.PDTV.x264:                                                              │
│   - HR  PDTV  x264  encodes  are  allowed  for  non-HD  shows  airing fully │
│     upscaled on HD channels                                                 │
│   - Crop  to  closest  mod2  without  undercropping. Then, if  width>960 or │
│     height>540,  downscale  with 1:1 SAR to fit in 960x540.  Never upscale, │
│     never add borders.                                                      │
│   - All other standard rules apply                                          │
│                                                                             │
└───────┬┬───────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┬┬───────┘
┌───────┴┴───────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┴┴───────┐
│           The 720p x264 TV Releasing Standards 2011 (2011-06-15)            │
│                                                                             │
└───────┬┬───────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┬┬───────┘
┌───────┴┴───────────────┬──────────────────────────┬────────────────┴┴───────┐
│                        └--------[ GROUPS ]--------┘                         │
│                                                                             │
│             TVx2642k11 rules created by the following groups:               │
│             ─────────────────────────────────────────────────               │
│                aAF BALLS BiA C4TV DiCH DiVERGE FTP IMMERSE                  │
│                  KYR LMAO MOMENTUM NGCHD RiVER W4F WHEELS                   │
│                                                                             │
└──┬───────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┬──┘
 └----\  Thanks to the x264+matroska developers for their assistance in  /----┘
  └----\          determining the best mix of encode settings.          /----┘
   └----\                                                              /----┘


Persönlich finde ich den Wandel positiv, sieht man sich die letzten Relases an so hat CRF meiner Meinung nach für eine bessere Qualität bei den Scene Releases gesorgt.

Wer möchte soll mal folgende zwei Releases downloaden und vergleichen:
Game.of.Thrones.S01E09.720p.HDTV.CRF.x264-IMMERSE (1600MB)
Game.of.Thrones.S01E09.720p.HDTV.x264-CTU (oder orenji proper) (1493MB)

Die Qualität des IMMERSE release ist klar besser.
1 mal bearbeitet, zuletzt 27. Jun 2011, 15:10 Uhr

saftsau
saftsau User
27. Jun 2011, 15:18 Uhr
Sind die ersten 720p CRF Rules in der Scene oder? Mal gucken wann die German 720p Movie Rules angepasst werden.
War aber abzusehen, dass es in der US-Scene nicht gut ankommt. Die releasen ja auch 1080p noch mit 2-pass.

vote
vote out of order
2. Sep 2011, 23:03 Uhr
saftsau schrieb:
Die releasen ja auch 1080p noch mit 2-pass.

Es gibt auch schon ein paar CRF-Rips zwar von einer Group die normal PL Released... und eins von AMIABLE. Vielleicht entwickelt sich ja dort etwas. :O

Hop.2011.1080p.INTERNAL.BluRay.CRF.x264-AiHD_CE
The.Mechanic.2011.1080p.INTERNAL.BluRay.CRF.x264-AiHD_CE
Sanctum.2011.1080p.INTERNAL.BluRay.CRF.x264-AiHD_CE
Red.Riding.Hood.2011.1080p.INTERNAL.BluRay.CRF.x264-AiHD_CE
The.Fighter.2010.720p.INTERNAL.BluRay.CRF.x264-AiHD_CE
It.Could.Happen.To.You.1994.720p.INTERNAL.BluRay.CRF.x264-AiHD_CE The.Lord.of.the.Rings.The.Fellowship.of.the.Ring.2001.EXTENDED.iNT.DUAL.720p.BluRay.CRF.x264-AiHD_CE
Ironclad.2011.720p.INTERNAL.BluRay.CRF.x264-AiHD_CE
The.Adjustment.Bureau.2011.1080p.INTERNAL.BluRay.CRF.x264-AiHD_CE
Brazil.1985.720p.INTERNAL.BluRay.CRF.X264-AMIABLE

PS: Wer die NFOs dazu hat posten ;)

T-2-S
T-2-S Wait, I'll fix it!
3. Sep 2011, 00:32 Uhr
The.Fighter.2010.720p.INTERNAL.BluRay.CRF.x264-AiHD_CE

[Spoiler: Zum Lesen hier klicken!]

                                   ░   ▄   ░
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    ▓ #.                ▓    █▒█ █▓█   ▓   █▓█ █▓█ ▄▀     ALWAYS iN HiGH  ▓
      D. 12-08-2011    ░     █▓█ ███ ░     █▓█ ███▀         DEFiNiTiON
    ░                        ███      ░    ███ █▀                         ░
       . The Fighter (2010)
      V. x264 / 4529 kbps / 1280x720
      A. DTS / 1510 kbps; DTS / 1510 kbps
      T. 115 mins
      L. EN,PL / Subs: PL
       . Notes / Info
         This is the new beginning...
       http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0964517/
    ░  . Misc
                                                                          ░
         Brand new and fresh crew!
    ▓                                                                     ▓
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      A L W A Y S  i N  H i G H  D E F i N i T i O N   █▀▀▓ ▓ █▀▀▓ ▓▄▄▀  sh



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